Required Hop-Ups

If you take a stock chassis what are the required hop-ups to have a car that is consistent to drive and is reliable. I'm looking to get a dNaNo to practice with at home; I race Z's but my apartment is just way too small to put a Z track up in, but for dNaNo I could have enough room to get a few turns in.

I think bearings are obvious, but otherwise I'm not so sure. I think I'd want the ball diff simply because the feel of driving would probably be better.

-Jer

Hey

Basics hopup to me are bearings, ball diff and rear plate.
Gyro isn't that useful to me unless I use X-speed motor and I feel aluminum parts are mostly cosmetics.
Oh and the damper is good if you can fit it.

Hope it helps.

[MrNanoTrax]

definitely go with a gyro dude... you can always adjust how much it assists your driving with the ICS Cable. aluminum parts add weight which increases stability... the car will feel smoother when its heavier. check out my 'Race Spec: Breakdown' post at the nanotrax blog for everything i recommend.

[nitrojunkie]

Bearings,Kyosho Balldiff,Atomic dampner plate. If you are going to run on an HT track the gyro is a waste of money. If you will be running on a track with long straights and sweeping turns the gyro will help.The gyro deadens the car too much on short tight tracks.

[lornecherry]

gyro is track dependant, although I do recommend it, because you can simply unplug it for different track surfaces, or tune it down with ICS.

Higher grip tires for most surfaces (Atomic, PN or Kyosho) ...the rear aluminum hub is a must for me; the plastic one strips its set screw hole after 4 or 5 cleanings of the rear end (which you need to do).

Other than that, the differential, bearings are a must. I use a peice of foam instead of a commerical damper; cost less then a penny; but the damper is also good. Don't like carbon fibre rear plate, too stiff and same with Aluminum front plate. Again, your mileage may differ, and it really depends on whether you run on high speed track or slow and technical.

Start with the differential and bearings, rear alloy hub and perhaps gyro ...the rest is personal preferance and tuning to your running surface.

I almost forgot; upgrading the transmitter is high on my list; I'm dveloping a disdain for the Perfex 2.4GHz; it has more than glitches than Tiger Woods has girlfriends.

[microracer30]

I got more time to spend on the track now that it is closer to home, so I'm noticing all the flaws. I went all out on my subaru impreza wrc when I first bought it 5 months ago with bearings, kyosho ball diff, x-speed motor and gyro.

The first thing that I tried battling was the terrible bumping in the rear so I put a kyosho carbon hard H-plate. It helped a lot, but its still bumpy. I put PN #15 tires in rear, but it made it worse. put the stock ones back.
Will aluminum fr suspension steering plates/rear wheel hubs, #8 tires and atomic damper to perfect it?

The second attempt was the large steering radius (under-steer) that gets worse the faster you go. I didn't think the gyro was doing it so I put #40 tires in front that helped, but I think it could do better with a lower softer #.
Will getting rid of the ray gun, putting #35 in front and a getting an ICS cable to adjust the gyro Perfect it?

The last problem was the instant speed demon barrel roll. I know its the subaru body, its very top heavy, and, I know, the x-treme speed motor is too much for that track. I can tune the motor via ICS or throttle down VIA ex-1 ur.
So, is the mazda 787b still the best body, or is there something lower and wider?

money is no issue, I will perfect this track down and Ill keep posted on what works and doesn't.

[MrNanoTrax]

Originally Posted by microracer30

The first thing that I tried battling was the terrible bumping in the rear so I put a kyosho carbon hard H-plate. It helped a lot, but its still bumpy. I put PN #15 tires in rear, but it made it worse. put the stock ones back.

i don't know what tires work best for the HT Track (carpet) but the best combination normally across brands is PN Racing 45F/8R, Atomic 35F/8R, Kyosho 40F/10R.

Originally Posted by microracer30

Will aluminum fr suspension steering plates/rear wheel hubs, #8 tires and atomic damper to perfect it?

adding weight will help the car a lot... that means, the aluminum FSP/RWH, Aluminum Wheels, and SSG-DSP (will fit without body mod). the Subaru is flawed in that is body is too "tall" so no matter what you do, it will never compete well against other 'low profile' type cars that can be much more aggressive in cornering.

Originally Posted by microracer30

The second attempt was the large steering radius (under-steer) that gets worse the faster you go. I didn't think the gyro was doing it so I put #40 tires in front that helped, but I think it could do better with a lower softer #. Will getting rid of the ray gun, putting #35 in front and a getting an ICS cable to adjust the gyro Perfect it?

you'll need to adjust your turn radius no matter what as high speed + high grip = sharp turns, frequent rolls. the larger your radius, the less likely your car is to roll... with good grip, you can get good cornering at slow speed even with a larger radius. the transmitter is a personal preference but a better one will allow you to be more specific with tuning servo behavior... same with the ICS settings... it can help with the handling only by reducing servo response speed and other servo behavior.

Originally Posted by microracer30

The last problem was the instant speed demon barrel roll. I know its the subaru body, its very top heavy, and, I know, the x-treme speed motor is too much for that track. I can tune the motor via ICS or throttle down VIA ex-1 ur. So, is the mazda 787b still the best body, or is there something lower and wider?

the mazda 787 has some excellent characteristics. its not just a body as the body is related to the chassis characteristics but i get your point. the lower profile, wide, 'gt cars' are going to always outperform the 'street cars' so if you're looking to race and dominate, get yourself a set of fitting parts & slide into a new ride bro

[lornecherry]

...carpet or felt of any kind causes rear-end hopping. I did extensive testing on this. Cars that behaved miserably on felt, performed flawlessly on foam, which has a little more give. (The felt is great for tight technical tracks, but horrible for high speed turns). I'll bet Q'on has very little of this issue on his (foam) tracks. You need less grip in front also if you are traction rolling; changing the grip on the front end may also widen your turning radius though.
--
Try your car on different surfaces (i.e. foam) and see if the problems go away. Now, I know that doesn't help if you are running on the HTUSA tracks, but it will help you tune the car and understand the dynamics. With respect to rear damping, I use a 1-cent piece of foam in the back of all my cars and get no rear-end shake in any of our 6 cars. The commerical dampners also work well, but I suspect mostly because they add a touch of weight to the rear end. Unfortunately its high-up weight and that's a no-no with the d'nano ...especially if you are having traction roll problems. Keep any added weight as low as possible.
--
I also suspect your differential is setup incorrectly. Should be like your dream date after a few drinks ...nice and smooth and loose. Most I've seen are way too tight. The front traction roll is three things: tires, weight distribution/weight height, and also ... this is a an odd-ball fix, but aluminum rims weigh in at slightly more than the stock rims and really help to smooth the car out.
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Check front-end springs for any binding and spin front wheels and make sure they are very smooth and the front end isn't gunked up. Do not use any kind of oil on the front end if you are running on carpet/felt ...it's a fibre magnet ...use dry graphite lube only.
---
Take out the X-speed until the car is setup perfectly. The X-Speed will only magnify problems, and on the HTSA track (or any other small track) you need speed out of the corners ...so a different pinion/spur combo will probably help more.
---
The more testing I do with the new lap timing equip that announces each lap, the more I'm convinced that smooth beats fast each and every time. Keep that in mind when tuning.

Also keep this in mind: any of the advice I've given (or that of others) may be completely wrong ...setups are almost completely surface-dependent; and, as I don't have the same felt/carpet surface that HTSA uses, I can't give an exact setup for your car ...I just know that carpet is harder to get rid of rear-end axle hop and turning radius inconsitency on right vs. left.

Q'on's guide on his site is a real good hop-up/setup advice page and my testing agrees with 99% of his setup recommendations (we differ on the damper). Just keep in mind that we agree because we are both tuning for a foam surface.

[lornecherry]

...agree with Q'on oon the car type; the Mazda is much smoother and better balanced than most others ...mine is sans the rear wing, which again, is weight high up.

[nitrojunkie]

Smoothness is the key to the HT track.Once you have this and a consistant line the speed will come. How clean you keep your tires also makes a difference, a wipedown with denatured alcohol or rc car cleaner will work but in a pinch just lick your thumb and wipe the tires down.If you are not turning enough just clean the fronts for more front bite.

[microracer30]

someone at the track told me you can cut two pieces of cf and screw one on the body, then the other on the motor pod. Then apply dampening oil between them. That way you can cut some of the top weight and fit more bodies without drilling giant holes in the rear windshield.

[Chris Moore]

Originally Posted by microracer30

I got more time to spend on the track now that it is closer to home, so I'm noticing all the flaws. I went all out on my subaru impreza wrc when I first bought it 5 months ago with bearings, kyosho ball diff, x-speed motor and gyro.

The first thing that I tried battling was the terrible bumping in the rear so I put a kyosho carbon hard H-plate. It helped a lot, but its still bumpy. I put PN #15 tires in rear, but it made it worse. put the stock ones back.
Will aluminum fr suspension steering plates/rear wheel hubs, #8 tires and atomic damper to perfect it?

The second attempt was the large steering radius (under-steer) that gets worse the faster you go. I didn't think the gyro was doing it so I put #40 tires in front that helped, but I think it could do better with a lower softer #.
Will getting rid of the ray gun, putting #35 in front and a getting an ICS cable to adjust the gyro Perfect it?

The last problem was the instant speed demon barrel roll. I know its the subaru body, its very top heavy, and, I know, the x-treme speed motor is too much for that track. I can tune the motor via ICS or throttle down VIA ex-1 ur.
So, is the mazda 787b still the best body, or is there something lower and wider?

money is no issue, I will perfect this track down and Ill keep posted on what works and doesn't.

If you want to go fast on the HT carpet track get the fitting kit and mazda 787b body, the best money you'll ever spend. That will eliminate the majority of the rolling and most of the hopping issues. You can forget about the gyro, the 3p infield track layout that the HT's are using(most anyway) is to small for the gyro to be of any help. If you really like the body you have then buy alum wheels, and the dampner, this will still give you some rolling issues as that is mostly a factor of the high CG and narrow wheelbase of the Subaru.

Now the hopping can be solved a couple of ways, first if you go to the mazda body all you will need is a piece of strapping tape on the stock suspension plate, or continue to use the optional CF plate you have. Make sure that you mount the tape the same direction as the plate. The tape fibers keep the plate from flexing so much. If you still get some hop with this you can try the foam trick, I place the foam between the main chassie body and the motor/axle housing. Again this does'nt allow the rear of the car to flex up and forward very much. The second and more expensive option is to buy the dampner, This is the best way but the more expensive way and you will have to drill a large hole in most of the dnano bodys for clearance.

I've put over 5000 laps on the HT track and I had major hopping issues with my Porsche 962, I spent countless time trying to resolve this untill I very recently bought the dampner. I installed that and went from inconsistant 5sec laps to consistant 4.5-4.7 lap times

After you change to the dampner or the mazda body all you will need is the stock fronts, and #20 rear tires cleaned each run with windex or motor spray.

Have fun
Chris

[MINI-D]

Hi Chris,
I am asking you for help on two threads. can you post pictures ? of your
strapping tape mod and your foam trick, how big and how stiff is the foam ?


Thank You.

D

PS Chris I did a post under: Ball Bearing Diff??, thread that may help you ?

[Chris Moore]

Originally Posted by MINI-D

Hi Chris,
I am asking you for help on two threads. can you post pictures ? of your
strapping tape mod and your foam trick, how big and how stiff is the foam ?


Thank You.

D

Sure here you go, first the underside of the body(my Enzo in this case) so you can see the foam.

Then with the chassie in place, note that the foam should be thick enough so that the rear axle housing should be in contact with the foam here. The thickness, and density/stiffness of the foam will depend on how much your car is hopping. This is a trial and error process untill you get the desired result. With this setup this car only hops(a little bit) if I'm full on the gas in the tight middle of the infield.

And a pic of the stock H-plate with tape.

[MINI-D]

Chris Thank You so much for the pictures, they are worth a thousand words.
I will try both of them the simplicity is kick-a$$, and as you said 0 dollars.
nice work

D